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Message Board > Fenix / Bennu / Gemix / DIV > DIV is back!... Gemix Studio, the new DIV3


July 19, 2008, 13:32
PB Defender of the faith 630 posts	El recurso requerido (/VSManager/GemixStudioB5.zip) no está disponible. But after little searching I did find the downloadable Beta 5: http://gemixstudio.se32.com/Ge … StudioBeta5.rar Accept for one incompatibility it did compile my solitair code: yay! Apparently "compiler_options _case_sensitive;" required different use of cases than DIV2 did. Once I removed that line it worked fine... [Edited on July 19, 2008 by PB] ____________
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July 19, 2008, 16:04
Htbaa Perl 368 posts	I wonder why they don't put their time and effort in Bennu and come up with smashing tools... ____________ blog.htbaa.com
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July 19, 2008, 21:05
Sandman F3n!x0r 1194 posts	Indeed. ____________ BennuWiki Yes, my avatar has grey borders in IE (so get a decent browser) ROOFLEZ ROOFLEZ
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July 19, 2008, 23:36
PB Defender of the faith 630 posts	Quoting RST: This beta is only to show the product to the people and to allow the maximun number of them to test the most big number of programs to know the possible bugs and other minor issues. I'm impressed with the beta I've downloaded, but where should we log the found defects? So far I've already found the following: - Rand returns the same "random" values each game (this was not the case in DIV2, even if you didn't seed). - As mentioned the case sensitive compiler option is not backwards compatible. - CTRL+Q in the editor... [Edited on July 20, 2008 by PB] ____________
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July 20, 2008, 20:33
GINO None 15 posts	Hi, this is my first post here. I hope we can answer all your questions about Gemix Studio. Quote: El recurso requerido (/VSManager/GemixStudioB5.zip) no está disponible. You can download beta 5.2 (the last one) here: Download GemixStudio beta 5.2 This beta also includes a basic visual tool to view/convert map files called MapGenX, so the creation of images to use in your programs will be very easy. Quote: - Rand returns the same "random" values each game (this was not the case in DIV2, even if you didn't seed). Oook this bug is fixed, thanks a lot for the report Quote: - As mentioned the case sensitive compiler option is not backwards compatible. We have tried to debug that, but... it seems that this feature work fine in our programs. Can you post more specific info or code about that error? Thanks. Quote: - CTRL+Q in the editor... Hehehe... well... this ide... it is only an editor done for you to write and compile programs without use the command line. It is very primitive and has erros, but don't worry, a powerful, consistent editor is in development. It will come with the beta 5.3. PB, you can post any suggestion, report bugs, ask any question, etc in the gemix forum at divsite (http://forum.divsite.net/) Quote: I wonder why they don't put their time and effort in Bennu and come up with smashing tools... Well, the answer to this question is very simple: Gemix Studio IS NOT Bennu. We don't like Bennu's philosophy, it is getting far away from DIV's philoshophy, we don't like it, neither the way it is being developed. We have developed Gemix Studio since 2005, it has a reputable TEAM before it, that want Gemix Studio to be a very professional product. In our opinion Gemix is better, faster, more powerful than bennu in terms of performance. Gemix is one of the languages that will be part of Gemix Studio. Its primal function is to be fully compatible with DIV. Other languages more advanced and up-to-date will be part of the final Gemix Studio. Well, thanks a lot to everyone interested in this project. If you have any question, bug to report, etc, you can feel free to post it in the Gemix forum at divsite (http://forum.divsite.net/). We will soon have our own forum and also an official page. Please, be patient. I hope you enjoy our hard work Bye, GINO [Edited on July 20, 2008 by GINO] ____________
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July 20, 2008, 22:14
Sandman F3n!x0r 1194 posts	Welcome to BS. How crossplatform is Gemix? Will it run on the GP2X? Dreamcast? BSD? BeOS? Solaris? Linux? I take it it's closed source? And will the final product be only commercially available? Quoting GINO: In our opinion Gemix is better, faster, more powerful than bennu in terms of performance. This doesn't say much. Why is this your opinion, i.e. on what is it based? Is it hardware accelerated? Is there a FAQ somewhere so I don't spam questions already answered? Thanks. ____________ BennuWiki Yes, my avatar has grey borders in IE (so get a decent browser) ROOFLEZ ROOFLEZ
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July 20, 2008, 22:20
Htbaa Perl 368 posts	Portability is fine Sandman, but really, who wants to play games on BeOS or Solaris? Oh and Sandman is right, Welcome to Booleansoup! Will Gemix natively be in the Spanish language? Just like Fenix, which was a big con. Because it limited the community mainly to Spanish users. And of course a few die hards who can't read Spanish but do try :-). ____________ blog.htbaa.com
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July 20, 2008, 23:59
GINO None 15 posts	Hi. SANDMAN --------- Gemix runs only in windows for the time being. The final product will be crossplatform. Yes, this is a 'closed source' product and it will be only commercially available. Well, our opinion on Gemix superiority in terms of performance is based on tests, of course. Gemix is superior in most aspects (performance, audio system, string manipulation and other stuff), this is a fact. Anyone can make this tests and compare. And please, don't say things like "Bennu remains superior in any way" in public without have done all this tests like we did. It isn't hardware accelerated for the moment, but of course it will be. A FAQ... well, we are waiting to set up our own official page that will include an extensive FAQ and documentation. You can refer to de documents that come with the betas (list of new functions and parameters, history of changes, etc) for the moment. --------- HTBAA --------- Hehehe, the team is composed by spanish people (i'm spanish) but the main programmer as well as the coordinator of the project is italian (nickname Cictec). --------- By the way, it isn't our intention to compare over and over again Gemix Studio and Bennu. We only want you to enjoy this great project... and to have fun playing your games. Bye and thanks for reply. ____________
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July 21, 2008, 00:23
Htbaa Perl 368 posts	Quote: And please, don't say things like "Bennu remains superior in any way" in public without have done all this tests like we did. You shouldn't say so either until you release the test results to the public. I remember Fenix getting in a bit of trouble because Fast Track had the rights to the DIV file formats or something like that. Isn't this going to be a problem for Gemix? About localization: Keep the main language of your website English. Really. But I guess that won't be too big of a problem considering some members are Spanish and some are Italian. Will Gemix also be able to interface with other languages? Like BlitzMax can with C, C++, Object C and ASM? Any price indications for Gemix when it'll be released? Also, is there a ETA release date? ____________ blog.htbaa.com
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July 21, 2008, 00:51
Sandman F3n!x0r 1194 posts	Quote: Well, our opinion on Gemix superiority in terms of performance is based on tests, of course. Gemix is superior in most aspects (performance, audio system, string manipulation and other stuff), this is a fact. Anyone can make this tests and compare. And please, don't say things like "Bennu remains superior in any way" in public without have done all this tests like we did. Back up your claims yourself, please. This is a bit hypocrite, no? You seem to have a wrong impression of Bennu. I'm sure Gemix can be superior when it comes to audio, video, strings, interpreting, compiling, whatnot, but I'd like to see that for myself. And comparing to Bennu is actually quite useful, because it's something similar, no need to dis it. A big difference is that Bennu is (will be, actually) FOSS, so it can be compiled for any system, like ARM CPU based systems. Gemix however is closed source and would rely on the team to do such a thing. Will it be modular, like Bennu? Is it possible to write my own video/audio/input/etc dll for it? Don't get me wrong, I like the effort that's being done and it sure will be nice if it turns out cool, but you must not try to put Bennu down by unsubstantiated claims. I know things haven't been going smoothly between some people, but they're both two nice projects. ____________ BennuWiki Yes, my avatar has grey borders in IE (so get a decent browser) ROOFLEZ ROOFLEZ
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July 21, 2008, 01:19
Htbaa Perl 368 posts	Let met get this straight. Gemix is a DIV like language and Gemix Studio will be the IDE with perhaps some other tools? Or is Gemix Studio much broader? ____________ blog.htbaa.com
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July 21, 2008, 01:34
Mezzmer Square-theorist 792 posts	Whereas I am already feeling good about the future for Bennu I have no reason to be excited by giving dollar away for a license on what is already essentially - free. As far as I can see, there is a commercial product under development making un-substantiated claims against a free open-source project which is pretty much the same thing. Quoting GINO: Gemix is one of the languages that will be part of Gemix Studio. Its primal function is to be fully compatible with DIV. This is dangerous ground in terms of thus - Is the "primal function" going to lead Gemix to be merely a clone of the DIV language with a few more functions? Another Fenix? There are a lot of people who would say that you are taking something that is free, putting a nice package around it and selling it. ____________
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July 21, 2008, 02:53
Sandman F3n!x0r 1194 posts	I reread the thread and I get now that you're annoyed by my post made on the 5th of May. I didn't realise you were quoting me in your post, but you seem to have omitted something, as I said any way I could think of, which says implicitly that I hadn't tried Gemix, so that my statement wasn't meant to be factual. My apologies if this was taken wrongly; if you put some tests online running Gemix and Bennu, I'll give them a try. ____________ BennuWiki Yes, my avatar has grey borders in IE (so get a decent browser) ROOFLEZ ROOFLEZ
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July 21, 2008, 18:02
GINO None 15 posts	Hi. --------- HTBAA --------- Quote: You shouldn't say so either until you release the test results to the public. We must make it clear that we only state Gemix superiority because there are people who said that Bennu is superior to Gemix probably without have tested all its aspects. We do internal tests, but we don't publish the results because it would be of bad taste. Gemix's betas come with examples that can be tested in private. If anyone wants to compare with other languages, always in private, please. Quote: remember Fenix getting in a bit of trouble because Fast Track had the rights to the DIV file formats or something like that. Isn't this going to be a problem for Gemix? Fenix had these problems because Fasttrack had announced the development of "DIV for Windows" and because Fenix was a free product (in contrast to DIV for Windows) compatible with the DIV's file formats. We know that Fasttrack has the rights to DIV and that Fasttrack closed down. We also know that Avanquest could have bought Fasttrack, so if Avanquest has the rights to DIV and it is interested in Gemix Studio, it will be the publisher, BUT only at development finished, not before. At the moment Gemix Studio is only a beta and it is a long time until it is finished. Quote: About localization: Keep the main language of your website English. Really. But I guess that won't be too big of a problem considering some members are Spanish and some are Italian. Will Gemix also be able to interface with other languages? Like BlitzMax can with C, C++, Object C and ASM? We know the requirements that a product has to have to be commercial and to compete with another products. Gemix Studio will have english support like all products of this kind, that's for sure. Quote: Any price indications for Gemix when it'll be released? Also, is there a ETA release date? We don't know any release date yet, the development of Gemix Studio is a long way. We will upload a lot of betas to let users to test, make suggestions and start to develop games. Quote: Let met get this straight. Gemix is a DIV like language and Gemix Studio will be the IDE with perhaps some other tools? Or is Gemix Studio much broader? Gemix Studio is the name of the whole product. It follows the philosophy of DIV Games Studio 2 (An integrated environment with all the utilities). As well as Visual Studio counts with an unique environment but multiple language possibilities (C++, Visual Basic, C#), Gemix Studio will do, but with its own 'DIV like' languages with different evolutions and a lot of graphical utilities. Gemix is the first of this languages and it is compatible with DIV, the other languages won't. ---------------- SANDMAN ---------------- Quote: Will it be modular, like Bennu? In the previous page of this thread an user post the current features of Gemix. Anyway, anybody who download the betas and test them can see that it is clearly modular. Quote: Is it possible to write my own video/audio/input/etc dll for it? The final version will count with an extensive SDK to allow users to create modules and extend Gemix Studio with them. Quote: Don't get me wrong, I like the effort that's being done and it sure will be nice if it turns out cool, but you must not try to put Bennu down by unsubstantiated claims. I know things haven't been going smoothly between some people, but they're both two nice projects. No one is saying that Bennu is a bad thing, but saying that it is superior to other language without have tested it isn't a good thing either. Don't forgett that I have witness Bennu's birth first hand. Bennu is a free language with its philosophy and ideas. Gemix Studio 'wants' to be the official DIV Games Studio 3, continuing the original project with Gemix at least and extending it with more features. They have one common thing: to achieve fulfil the dreams of people who wants to make a videogame. Quote: I reread the thread and I get now that you're annoyed by my post made on the 5th of May. I didn't realise you were quoting me in your post, but you seem to have omitted something, as I said any way I could think of, which says implicitly that I hadn't tried Gemix, so that my statement wasn't meant to be factual. My apologies if this was taken wrongly; if you put some tests online running Gemix and Bennu, I'll give them a try It isn't necessary to apologize. Like we said before we don't want to publish any test results concerning any comparison beetwen languages and we think that it doesn't make sense anyone does. If anyone wants to compare: 1) he must take into account that Gemix only uses the software module at the moment. The hardwade modules will be developed later on. 2) he must compare all aspects. It isn't like compare C and ASM for example. This is a program to create video games and all aspects must be take into account (language, libraries, audio, video, etc...). Anyway as we have said in the Divsite forum, Fenix as language is more advanced than Gemix because we only have add DIV compativility at the moment. ------------------ SQUARE ------------------ Quote: Whereas I am already feeling good about the future for Bennu I have no reason to be excited by giving dollar away for a license on what is already essentially - free. As far as I can see, there is a commercial product under development making un-substantiated claims against a free open-source project which is pretty much the same thing. Everybody is free to use which product to use. If you preffer to use something free you only have to use it. Anyway, Gemix Studio will count with features that Bennu won't and viceversa. They aren't exactly the same thing, they are only useful to do the same thing: making video games. Quote: This is dangerous ground in terms of thus - Is the "primal function" going to lead Gemix to be merely a clone of the DIV language with a few more functions? Another Fenix? There are a lot of people who would say that you are taking something that is free, putting a nice package around it and selling it. The development of Gemix at language level isn't finished, we work on the compatibility at the moment. ------------------------------- Please, don't start any attack. We have only answered your questions. It is a good thing that the number of "DIV like" languages increases. Some people preffer to use payment software and other people free software. ____________
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July 21, 2008, 19:24
Htbaa Perl 368 posts	Hi Gino, Thanks for the clear answers. I'm glad we didn't scare you away :-). I'm curious about how Gemix will develop and hope to see it get finished and supported. I must say I was rather surprised how the DIV example games just compiled without any problems. Please keep us updated about any developments with Gemix. ____________ blog.htbaa.com
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July 22, 2008, 23:58
Mezzmer Square-theorist 792 posts	Quoting GINO: Everybody is free to use which product to use. If you preffer to use something free you only have to use it. Anyway, Gemix Studio will count with features that Bennu won't and viceversa. They aren't exactly the same thing, they are only useful to do the same thing: making video games. I feel quite insulted you come to our forum posting under DIV/ Fenix / Bennu with an alternative commercial product that you have so far only given me half a reason to want to buy. Instead you give us a huge sales pitch while making me look the cunt. Quoting GINO: Some people preffer to use payment software and other people free software. Certain people are working very hard to release the next Bennu version just for the love of games-making and developing such a valuable and usuable language such as DIV - with no cash incentive involved. It sems you are washing you are already washing your hands of this discussion because half of the people in this thread are polite admins. Well, I'm allowed to speak my mind and - you are a fraud. ____________
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July 23, 2008, 00:00
Mezzmer Square-theorist 792 posts	Quoting GINO: Quoting Square: This is dangerous ground in terms of thus - Is the "primal function" going to lead Gemix to be merely a clone of the DIV language with a few more functions? Another Fenix? There are a lot of people who would say that you are taking something that is free, putting a nice package around it and selling it. The development of Gemix at language level isn't finished, we work on the compatibility at the moment. How is that for an ice-cold sales pitch! ____________
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July 23, 2008, 00:31
Sandman F3n!x0r 1194 posts	Now now, both products have their merit and goals. Can't blame the man for advertising a product he and some other dudes are working hard on. ____________ BennuWiki Yes, my avatar has grey borders in IE (so get a decent browser) ROOFLEZ ROOFLEZ
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July 23, 2008, 00:52
Htbaa Perl 368 posts	Come on Square. Don't forget Gemix will be a complete studio like DIV always was. All Fenix is is just a language with a BIG lack of tools. Gemix studio tends to be more like DIV Games Studio. A complete package. And why shouldn't they be allowed to charge money for it? Hammer Technologies and Fast Track did. [Edited on July 23, 2008 by Htbaa] ____________ blog.htbaa.com
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July 23, 2008, 01:46
GINO None 15 posts	Hi. ------ SQUARE ------ We only have answered your questions, without offend anybody. We don't know why you feel so offensed, and why do you open another thread confronting moreover both products? (you are free to do it, but...). We have just said that you can use the product that you want. Our idea and philosophy of what Gemix Studio will be moves away fom Fenix/Bennu, that's why we said they are (or will be) very diferent. And one more thing, we didn't come here posting anything about Gemix... it was another people that has no relation to the project in any way. We only came here with the intention of answer to the questions and in particular to those bug reports (we thank the users of this forum to report as well as Divsite forum users do). You think we are a fraud... well, its your opinion. We are uploading betas that people can download and fully use for free. Feel free to use what product you want. ----------------- Sandman & Htbaa ----------------- We are very happy all this misunderstandings have been solved. Thanks for your politeness on your answers. [Edited on July 23, 2008 by GINO] ____________
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July 23, 2008, 02:17
Rincewind programmer 1545 posts	Squarepusher, there is no reason whatshowever to be hostile, would you mind to tone it down? Quoting Square: Quoting GINO: Everybody is free to use which product to use. If you preffer to use something free you only have to use it. Anyway, Gemix Studio will count with features that Bennu won't and viceversa. They aren't exactly the same thing, they are only useful to do the same thing: making video games. I feel quite insulted you come to our forum posting under DIV/ Fenix / Bennu with an alternative commercial product that you have so far only given me half a reason to want to buy. Instead you give us a huge sales pitch while making me look the cunt. Gino is more than welcome on this forum, the DIV/Fenix/Bennu forum is the appropriate forum for this as GEMIX is DIV-based, and there is nothing wrong with GEMIX being commercial. Nobody is required to convince you to buy this as you seem to imply, as Gino already stated you're free to use what you like. Gino has been kindly answering questions from the start and in no way is 'giving a huge sales pitch'. The only one that can make you look like a cunt is yourself, and rest assured you just succeeded. Please excuse Squarepusher, Gino, and thanks for answering questions. It's sad to see all this (unasked for) tension in this thread. ____________ Personal website: http://www.loijson.com
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July 23, 2008, 14:09
Mezzmer Square-theorist 792 posts	Quoting GINO: We don't know why you feel so offensed, and why do you open another thread confronting moreover both products? Some people are unaware of what exactly Bennu is in relation to Fenix and how in the future it could be a free programming alternative to Gemix. That is why i opened the thread, for open friendly discussion amongst people who have nothing to do with development of either. Is that hard to understand? ____________
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July 23, 2008, 17:19
GINO None 15 posts	Well, you are also unaware of what Gemix Studio will totally be, so you can't say that Bennu will be an alternative to it. There are people that are already using Gemix in their projects despite they know it is a payment product and that there is Bennu. Each one has his own ideas, yours is to use a free product and we respect it, but you should respect us as well, please. ____________
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July 23, 2008, 18:53
PEader お前はもう死んでいる 1486 posts	I'm confused. Is Gemix is a branch of the Fenix code or is it separate? ____________ I see 57,005 people.
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July 23, 2008, 19:50
Sandman F3n!x0r 1194 posts	Gemix is a separate product, unaffiliated with Fenix or Bennu, but aims at first at compatibility with DIV1 and DIV2. This is the same with Fenix and Bennu. Fenix 1.0 branch was intended to be fully compatible and possible doing some more stuff (?), Fenix 2.0 is more aimed to be just awesome. The first Bennu release is intended to be compatible with Fenix 0.93 (and therefore largely with DIV1 and DIV2) and possibly DIV1 and DIV2 completely. Later releases won't focus on this. This backwards compatibility will be achieved by use of modules, so if one so desires, the modules can be left out, leaving only Bennu as the language and the possibility to add other modules. Gemix aims for DIV1 and DIV2 compatibility and later expand on this (if I understand it correctly). So I don't know what the Gemix team have in mind for Gemix, but this sounds very much similar, except for the commercial vs free business. Both products plan on expanding, not only when it comes to modules, but also the language itself. ____________ BennuWiki Yes, my avatar has grey borders in IE (so get a decent browser) ROOFLEZ ROOFLEZ
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Message Board > Fenix / Bennu / Gemix / DIV > DIV is back!... Gemix Studio, the new DIV3

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